AHRMA @ Barber (Biker news)

[VF500]

My son and I spent the weekend at Barber watching the vintage motorcycle races. Doug Polen was there and showed the guys how it's done. He's still scary fast, as a former four time world champion should be. I bumped into Mitch Boehm who was racing a vintage Kawasaki. Mitch is the former editor of Motorcylist magazine. Being retired and on social security, you folks financed my weekend. I'm deeply appreciative to all of you. :D Here's Mitch with some old guy who's probably a trouble maker.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v386/sanglant/MeandMitch.jpg

[Kasturi]

I am glad you had a good time while you were there. Unfortunately since I helped finance your weekend, you owe me a refund on the beer that you drank. I did not agree to more than 3 beers. I wont even get into how much I should get back on the hotdogs that you had.

Just remember that you will have less money for the next event that you go to do to this refund you owe me. I shall be deducting that from my next Social Security contribution.

[VF500]

I am glad you had a good time while you were there. Unfortunately since I helped finance your weekend, you owe me a refund on the beer that you drank. I did not agree to more than 3 beers. I wont even get into how much I should get back on the hotdogs that you had.

Just remember that you will have less money for the next event that you go to do to this refund you owe me. I shall be deducting that from my next Social Security contribution.
Actuallly, I took it easy on you and didn't drink any beer (I was riding) and my wife made sandwiches for me and my son. See, I'm looking out for you poor working slobs. ;)

[heyhey]

My next door neighbor and dear friend and Harley Enthusiast was critically injured in a motorcycle accident this Saturday. He has two children under age five. He is fighting for his life in the ICU right now...

please pray for him.

I worked for years in the ER as a nurse and have seen famlies lives destroyed riding bikes... no not thier fault usually .... but I would NEVER EVER let my minor child ride on a motorcycle.. and would take serious exception if my husband ever got the longing to buy or ride one...I have seen too much of what can happen

this weekend only cemented my earlier views.

[alex n]

My next door neighbor and dear friend and Harley Enthusiast was critically injured in a motorcycle accident this Saturday. He has two children under age five. He is fighting for his life in the ICU right now...

please pray for him.

I worked for years in the ER as a nurse and have seen famlies lives destroyed riding bikes... no not thier fault usually .... but I would NEVER EVER let my minor child ride on a motorcycle.. and would take serious exception if my husband ever got the longing to buy or ride one...I have seen too much of what can happen

this weekend only cemented my earlier views.

People who ride motorcycles are a different breed. The benefit doesn't outway the risk in my mind. No one will ever catch me on a bike.

[mbossman2]

riding is a personal choice and it is a practice in risk minimization.

even after minimizing the risk: proper gear, proper training, skill practice, riding location selection, proper physical and mental attitude, it is quite possible the existing level of risk is still too high for some people.

and that's fine, to each their own. I am sure that there are activities that others participate in that gives the "yikes!" (sky diving and scuba diving).

If you want to ride? great, glad to have you but make sure that you get the basics out of the way:
MSF BRC training
Good solid protective gear (full faced helmet, good motorcycle jacket with armor, pants with armor, gloves and solid supportive bots)
Practice (parking lots on a Sunday mornings are lonely and want you to use them)

and know, realize and accept that you can do everything 100% prefect and then some distracted soccer mommy, chatting on her cell phone, drinking her starbucks and keeping the kids in back inline, makes a left hand turn right in front of you and *bang*.

Don't believe me? according to the Hurt Report 75% of motorcycle accidents are between 2 vehicles and a large proportion of them come from the riders left front.

Riding is NOT for everyone and if there is even the slightest amount of doubt in your mind or in the mind of your partner, then stop, go no further as you will more than likely be distracted and there is nothing worse than a distracted rider (except one under the influence).

[VF500]

My next door neighbor and dear friend and Harley Enthusiast was critically injured in a motorcycle accident this Saturday. He has two children under age five. He is fighting for his life in the ICU right now...

please pray for him.

I worked for years in the ER as a nurse and have seen famlies lives destroyed riding bikes... no not thier fault usually .... but I would NEVER EVER let my minor child ride on a motorcycle.. and would take serious exception if my husband ever got the longing to buy or ride one...I have seen too much of what can happen

this weekend only cemented my earlier views.
There was a study done by a group called the Hurt Report. It found that 80% of multi vehicle accidents involving motorcycles were not the fault of the motorcyclist. Motorcycles aren't the danger. It's riding on the same roads with people in cars and trucks. Unfortunately, people in four wheel vehicles have their heads "somewhere" and hurt people on two wheels. I guess everyone needs to drive some kind of tank to protect themselves. Maybe big SUVs aren't so terrible.

[VF500]

Don't believe me? according to the Hurt Report 75% of motorcycle accidents are between 2 vehicles and a large proportion of them come from the riders left front.

The report broke down a rider's perimeter into the twelve segments of a clock. I believe the 75% you mention is total percentage of wrecks that come from the front left quadrant, which is the nine to twelve O'clock segments. The percentage for multi vehicle accidents puts 80% of the blame on the other vehicle. I remember only 5% of cyclists are hit in the rear, the six O'clock segment. On my 10R I'd have to be sitting at a stop light to be hit in the rear!! :p

BTW, I'm now a scooter owner too. I brought home a Yamaha Zuma from over in Georgia today. It sounds like a weed whacker. :eek:

[VF500]

People who ride motorcycles are a different breed. The benefit doesn't outway the risk in my mind. No one will ever catch me on a bike.
I'm not easy to catch on a bike either! :D

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v386/sanglant/Mytrackbike.jpg

[heyhey]

my friend/neighbor is still in critical condition in the ICU. He still has two children under age 5.
I agree the motorcyclist statistically is not at fault... but the fact this is a more dangerous mode of transportation is still there..

and I would never let my children ride on one.
this isnt a question of fault...

go volunteer one day in a trauma center... see what road rash over > 30% of your body looks like... young kids in comas from head injuries because their states (like my state) made helmets optional...

look I'm not saying they should be outlawed... but I personally as a parent would not only not take that risk letting my child ride... I'd never ride knowing doing so was risking making my child an oprhan... or with a brain impaired parent...

[mbossman2]

and that is your choice...some of us choose otherwise

[VF500]

my friend/neighbor is still in critical condition in the ICU. He still has two children under age 5.
I agree the motorcyclist statistically is not at fault... but the fact this is a more dangerous mode of transportation is still there..

and I would never let my children ride on one.
this isnt a question of fault...

go volunteer one day in a trauma center... see what road rash over > 30% of your body looks like... young kids in comas from head injuries because their states (like my state) made helmets optional...

look I'm not saying they should be outlawed... but I personally as a parent would not only not take that risk letting my child ride... I'd never ride knowing doing so was risking making my child an oprhan... or with a brain impaired parent...
You sound lke me and my wife when our son bought his first bike. We both read him the riot act about how dangerous bikes are. That's pretty typical of people who don't know anything about bikes other than the horror stories they hear. In less than seven months we both had one and all three of us went on rides together.

[mbossman2]

moderator note: please do not let this conversation devolve into a back and forth on the relative merits and safety of riding and "I won't let me child..." or "I have seen..."


All riders are (or should be) aware of the risks involved in riding. Most of us have evaluated the risks and hazards of riding, taken steps to minimize the risks (training, gear and a more defensive riding) and accept that remaining level of risk.

[JoeM]

Risk is everywhere. Most newspapers have a section for local news or whatever where there is a daily littany of car wrecks and the carnage that goes with them. People who would never allow their children, hisband, wife, whatever, to ride a motorcycle read those articles everyday and then go out and get in their car and head out without a thought to the risk.

If you are not takling any risks you are not really living.

[VF500]

Does anyone know what the leading cause of death is amoung black youth? It's not car wrecks or motorcycles or anything like that. It's being shot to death by another black youth in theirown neighborhood. How ya gonna minimize that risk?

[Kuch]

In my opinion, motorcycle riders today understand the risks involved with such a mode of transportation. If they accept them and have insurance, then they are more than entitled to their happiness.

[alex n]

There was a study done by a group called the Hurt Report. It found that 80% of multi vehicle accidents involving motorcycles were not the fault of the motorcyclist. Motorcycles aren't the danger. It's riding on the same roads with people in cars and trucks. Unfortunately, people in four wheel vehicles have their heads "somewhere" and hurt people on two wheels. I guess everyone needs to drive some kind of tank to protect themselves. Maybe big SUVs aren't so terrible.

It seems irrelevant whether the accident was the motorcyclists fault. It doesn't make it any less dangerous.

Am I right or am I right?

[mbossman2]

It seems irrelevant whether the accident was the motorcyclists fault. It doesn't make it any less dangerous.

Am I right or am I right?

you are (sort of) correct.

if it's you who are hit or the one doing the hitting, hurt or dead is hurt or dead.

It is knowing that the risk is there and taking the appropriate steps avoid it.

[alex n]

you are (sort of) correct.

if it's you who are hit or the one doing the hitting, hurt or dead is hurt or dead.

It is knowing that the risk is there and taking the appropriate steps avoid it.

I would imagine that a motorcyclist would do everything within their power to not be the one doing the hitting. It seems logical that the person in the car/truck/suv would be more often than not the person doing the hitting since they are not risking serious bodily injury and possible death.

I wonder how many accidents involving motorcycles occur among cyclists who are just bad drivers or that take unnecessary risks.

[mbossman2]

I wonder how many accidents involving motorcycles occur among cyclists who are just bad drivers or that take unnecessary risks.

those would classified under single vehicle accident

here is a summary of the Hurt Report:

http://www.clarity.net/~adam/hurt-report.html